This conversation originally took place on Radio WORM, a community internet radio station run by, and inside of Rotterdam’s alternative cultural venue WORM. Our one and a half hour talk, interrupted only by a few short pieces of music and sound recordings, took place on the evening of Friday, March 24, 2023. We, Simon Kentgens and Florian Cramer, had been witnesses and peripheral participants of documenta fifteen in Kassel in the summer of 2022, and tried to draw our preliminary, personal conclusions after an intense and controversial event. For us, documenta fifteen was the culmination of a longer debate about radical collectivity and the commons in the arts.